Friday, 1 January 2010

The killer's not to blame

Astonishing news from the London Times in which we learn that Ibrahim Shkupolli, the Finnish mass murderer, wasn’t to blame for the attack!. According to peecee high-priest Roger Boyes “behind the horrific crime of an apparently deranged individual there was the deep-rooted problem of social exclusion.”

God love him. The poor dear!

This er, ‘victim’ was a Kosovar Albanian, and like most Albanians, lived by crime. Boyes agrees that “Shkupolli had been on the police register since at least 2003, when he was first convicted of illegal gun possession; the restraining order on visiting his ex-girlfriend showed that the courts considered him unpredictable and violent.”
Boyes then asks the questions “Why was action not taken? Why was he not referred for psychiatric treatment?”
My question would be, why wasn’t he sent back on the next plane to Kosovo?
He’d presumably be safe as Muslim Albanians now control that country. They gained control of that former Serbian province by way of massive illegal immigration and runaway breeding, transforming a Serb majority into a small minority within a couple of generations.

Any lesson there for Finland, I wonder?

Any lesson there for the rest of us, I wonder?


Zngr said...

What left-wing tripe. Then again, from what I know of the British left-wing social engineering and liberal thinking, suggesting that an adult criminal who is convicted of several illegal arms related and violent crimes needs THERAPY instead of prison, or in the case of an immigrant, an immediate removal from the country, is more or less the norm am I right?

Bonus points for basically calling Finns racist or at least lacking in equality for not giving Ibrahim his psychiatric treatment, as Mr. Boyes declares:

"If you are going to have a Nordic nanny state then it has to work for everybody, not just the native-born Finns".

If this clown tries to present himself as someone who has an inkling of what is going on in Finland, he should know that "native-born Finns", criminal or otherwise, only get treatment in the most extreme cases, if at all.

The public health-care sector has been downsized far beyond the demand, especially for mental patients. Most lunatics now roam the streets freely, instead of being treated in an institution.

And certainly people convicted of violent or gun related crimes are not offered "treatment" to begin with? Is this type of thinking so normalized in Britain they imagine other socities also try to treat - that is - "cure" criminals of some sort of illness, instead of locking them up? Do these left-liberals honestly think most of the world agrees with their ideological fantasy theories and have completely forgotten rational, objective analysis of social problems? Since certainly the norm in most of the world is still prison, not group drama and art therapy.

The only way to have it like Boyes demands suggests that we should give priority in mental care to violent and deranged immigrants instead of the vast masses of untreated depressed and insane Finns - and the past shows us that if the native population believes immigrants are getting special treatment or benefits, well, that's the basic script for creating outright, real racism and resentment towards immigrants.

There is already widespread anger over the fact asylum shoppers receive better benefits than Finnish students and pensioners.

Anonymous said...


huff said...

zngr - is it correct that Finns are beginning to get annoyed at the resurces being affoded to immigrants?

Zngr said...

huff - yes indeed it is, the discourse over the topic has taken at least a 90 degree turn during the last year or so and changed considerably during the past half decade from "diversity is EMPOWERING!" and "WE NEED MULTICULTURALISM" to "is diversity all that good to begin with?"

However our MSM politicians and MSM media is still mostly of the generation affected by the -68 left-wing radicalism, socialists and White Guilt types, and journalists receive their education in universities staffed by old school 60s leftists etc. Now, in these issues media has a lot of power and can mold the public discourse and perceptions. The national YLE network, funded by the tax-payers, is a nest of multiculturalism and relativism (unsurprisingly, the people working there have a joke that you have to be a social democrat and posses a party card to even get considered as an employee).

So there's a long, long road to go if we wish to see something like what happened in Denmark happening here, but at least from my perspective, we are better off than the Swedes or Norwegians. Not to mention Netherlands or Belgium... Or Britain.

For example this unfortunate incident, a criminal immigrant killing five Finns, has launched a huge outcry on the blogosphere, facebook and social medias against our immigration laws and policies - not against immigrants themselves mind you.

If I may say so, this shooting would not have reached much publicity on Sweden or at least the origins of the perp would have been kept under the lid during the last decade. For example one of the most gruesome gang rape incidents of the decade in Sweden, a tip of the iceberg probably, was not reported in any mainstream media outlets and even when it was, it claimed the perps were Swedes and Finns - when the reality was they were all Somalis who had gained asylum in either Sweden or Finland (- but most probably both to collect double benefits). News like this get into the public AS THEY ARE in Finland within hours. Even if the main stream media attempts to keep a lid on it, they can't do it anymore.

See, Finland got into the multicultitrain a little late, but it also means internet and medias outside of the MSM are more accessible and more natural for Finns to use (i.e. the internet). Many other countries had their immigration explosion in the 80s and 90s when information could be, and was, very tightly controlled by the public sector and media walking lock-step with the left-wing liberals or multiculturalists or whatever you want to call them.

In Finland's case, the multiculturization started in the early 90s and reached the first crisis events in the early 00s - when the internet was already open to much of the population and widely used to gather information. Hence, information travels much faster and "wrong", politically incorrect sentiments get into the open very fast. Bloggers, rogue politicians and parties with politically incorrect views cannot be shut down completely as effectively as they have been in the 80s or 90s in other parts of the EU.

For example Sweden never had this choice, nor did Norway until now when something like 30% of the residents of Oslo are Africans or Muslims in origin.

Zngr said...

In any case, Finland has very little immigration problems compared to the previously mentioned countries so that can mean two things. The discourse is often deflected by this fact (= there is no problem yet, shut up about immigration or you are a racists nazi), but on the other hand, it involves an educational factor: if ALL these other countries are now facing such terrible social issues with mass-immigration, particularly asylum seekers who multiply by family re-unification, many Finns, in my opinion, have begun to realize Finland will also face the same issues, unless immigration is handled properly before it escalates so far it cannot be controlled and we have our first ghettos that live outside of the Finnish law and order - what has already happened in our neighbouring Sweden.

Without internet, 90% of Finns would not be aware of the developments in Malmö or Rinkeby or Tensta in Stockholm. But now, many do and consider it something we don't want here. Even the odd mainstream politician and writer.

The 2011 elections will determine much of our countries future in the 10s and 20s.

There is definitely something bubbling under and it's not very happy about cultural relativism, diversity and multiculturalism as ideologies valued to be celebrated as simply "morally good" -isms without any negative impact or effect to our society.

huff said...

Thanks for that update zngr. It's reassuring to see that there is a reaction. In a sense this massacre was a good thing in its own way!

Zngr said...

huff - it's really difficult to think so. This will (or already has) generate some purely racist or xenophobic anti-immigration sentiment. We Finns kill people, most of all ex-spouses or drinking buddies while drunk with a high ratio compared to most EU countries so the crime is already described as "typically Finnish" event. Not only by the London Times that is. The left-wing liberals writing columns handily ignore the fact the shooter was ex-military, convicted criminal several times over, imported, and that Finns typically murder only their close relatives - instead of going out to a mall and execute people who have only minor involvement to their personal dramas. (Sounds like honor killings to me.)

The shooter was ex-military, more or less confirmed, and was extremely efficient regarding bullet usage. Two chest shots and one headshot or vice versa. He took some time with his ex-wife though, going though her with a knife close, slow and personal, possibly also removing her eyes (that's just a rumour at this point).

Furthermore it will drag the stupid, real racists out of the woods to spout shit that the MSM will find extremely vile. In fact, I find some of the texts I've read vile and irrational.

And launch a huge pro-immigration campaign from the ministry of interior trying to explain this as a typical Finnish case of mass murder and to further convince the public all immigration is "empowering" even if the public does not believe so.

This might also affect gun regulation further, meaning normal tax-payers will have a harder time renewing their license to own a gun for hunting or sport - irregardless of the fact the shooter was operating with an illegal firearm and that Kosovo Albanians will always remain in control of many guns no matter what sort of laws are issued.

This was simply a lose/lose scenario from my POV.

The one smart comment from about the 500 I've read came from police official Paatero who said we should really, really consider and consider hard which kind of asylum seekers we let stay in the country but it's very hard to wrap my brains around the fact this could spawn something positive, it appears it only energized the multiculturalists to blame Finns even MORE then previously and indeed invoked stupid shithead racists to attack all immigration which only servers to damage the cause of those who wish to impose more sensible foreigner laws.

Sad fucking New Years eve.

Israelieejit said...

Just another peace-loving Moslem doing his thing.

Anonymous said...

Stupid shithead racists? Did you ever consider that if the government people thought like them you wouldn't
be looking at the Somalization of your country. Its perfectly natural to stand up for your people. All the non white races do it and its not called racism. If fifty thousand Finns emigrated to Somalia how would the locals treat them?

Anonymous said...

Irish state television RTE never mentioned the fact that he was an Albanian muslim but did mention that Finland might have to tighten it gun laws.

Thats it, its the Finnish gun laws that at at fault not importing thousands of people of a different culture! Thats what MSM says so anyway.

RTE says more Muslims, Hindus and Buddhists for Ireland. Diversity is a good thing. Many people in the Ireland think the murder of Kriss Donald by a Pakistani gang in Glasgow was made up by the racist BNP because RTE didn't cover it.

Zngr said...

How typical, on today's paper a Muslim teacher in Arabic and an accomplished engineer among other things, working at a local university and former head of the Turkish community said that he considers it quite possible the murders were very much honour related. In Albania and much of Balkans a woman who causes her husband to "lose face" (for example by taking the man to public court, as the woman had) must be killed, as well as anyone who defends the woman (as her co-workers who were killed, all in some management position, had, by removing the killer out of the store premises previously etc). He also said we Finns and our police have "much to learn" about other cultures regarding honour related crimes and that there will be further honour killings in Finland.

On the following column a Finnish convert, professor in Islamic Studies and Arabic, Jaakko Hämeen-Anttila says what occurred is CERTAINLY NOT HONOUR RELATED, that honour killings do not exist in Finland and never will (bizarre, as this wasn't the first one), and basically that immigrants should shut up about their own things because HE, the FINNISH WHITE MAN, knows better.

Isn't that real racism or what? Deny other people their deep knowledge of their hereditary culture and tell them that some university academic in a Nordic countries knows their culture better. What the fuck is wrong with these morons? If the truth does not please, then it must be DENIED!

Sigh, what else is new. Immigrant says: hey, we have a problem. Multiculturalist tells immigrants to shut up and denies any problems, blames local white people of everything ever gone wrong.

H Grey said...

anon 16.04. Just thinking the same thing. You'd never think from the RTE coverage that this was anything but a native Finn doing what Finns seem to like doing. Mass shootings! and all of course due to the free availability of guns.


Anonymous said...

zngr - was the angineer saying it was honor-related in a condemnatory sense or approval?

Zngr said...

He's more of a scholar than an engineer, but very much condemnatory, no doubt. No support to any kind of honour violence, violence which I find many Muslims do not agree with, it's just that we hear mostly of the conservative ones (who either support barbaric behaviour - or deny it happens at all and call those who say otherwise islamophobes, a gimmick which is getting old) because they often claim to "speak for the Muslim community" somewhere, where in fact they don't, but where moderates will be threatened as apostates if they speak out against medieval behaviour. Which in turn Imams and those who wish to remain in the stone age (for example holding several wives in the role of domestic slaves, certainly a benefit for them) justify with Qur'an and thus hold a "moral" upper ground within the community. Luckily, the Muslim community in Finland is very small and very mixed ethnically, so in Finland - at least this far - any Muslim can probably disagree with conservative clerics or fundamentalists without much fear. Something which is not true in, say Sweden, Britain or Holland where the Muslim community is large enough to contain enough Islamists to threaten others into silence and deal fatwas left and right. I mean, in those countries Islamists are threatening the far larger majority of the secular NATIVES into silence and meek relativism, so you can just imagine their effect on the Muslim minorities as a whole.

He also went into explaining a little what honour killing is about for those Finns who go on disbelieving it really exists or differs from regular jealousy related violence in Finland.

I mean, at least 80% of the commentators this far, including one Minister, refuse to see the obvious, even probable connection of a violent Albanian (Albania where at least 10 000 honour related murders have occurred, since the year 2000, an astoundingly high number for such a small country) executing his ex-wife and her male colleagues who have protected her, and blindly believe in the fantasy the whole tragedy was "typically Finnish" and somehow my fault, or that of other ordinary Finns.

Oh political correctness, why can't it just fuck off back where it came from and give us back the values of Enlightenment.

Zngr said...

RE: Anon @ 14:58, yeah, stupid shithead racists. Those, you know, do exist. I would not want to live under a government that behaves like the types I'm talking about, i.e. people who want to chase all immigrants, irregardless of their worth, talents or beliefs, into the sea or who believe people with darker skin are inherently somehow inferior. People like that HURT the cause of those who simply want to keep immigration in check and make sure the sort of immigration we get is immigration that positively impacts our society.

See, if your movement or party or whatever contains neo-nazis or race supremacy elements, your movement or party will not be listened by anyone or ever taken seriously, because anything smart you say will always be overshadowed by morons preaching White Pride or chasing brown people on the street because of the colour of their skin pigment. Or when a party like that starts getting a lot of votes, well, things are already too far out of control. (Hello, UK.)

RE: H Grey: gun control is already so heavy it's almost impossible to get a handgun. I don't understand what RTE is talking about if they claim guns are somehow freely available. There was a news piece about it today. Police are worried, because as the gun controls have been tightened the past years, the black market for illegal arms has somehow started booming and the guns you get from the black market usually have more firepower. So making handguns from _almost_ impossible to get to impossible to get will not really affect anything in the long run. The black market remains and the guns come outside of Finland. It's also more or less impossible for another school shooter to get a semi-auto pistol via legal routes. Now the only thing you can do to get even more tight, is to start removing weapon licenses from hunters and sports shooters who already have a legal weapon.

As RTE etc. always fail to mention, the majority of Finnish guns are hunting rifles and shotguns, locked up in some cabin in the woods. Finns don't carry 9mm pistols or have loaded guns in their bedrooms. It's infuriating when left-wing news outlets always fail to mention this and paint the situation as something out of a bad Michael Moore propaganda flick about USA where everyone is supposedly toting automatic assault shotguns and carrying heavy caliber pistols to the supermarket. This has nothing to do with Finns and guns.

James McGrath said...

Is it me, or is it s bit too convienient for those gun controling types?

Sami said...

J McGrath - do you mean that the gun control people engineered this? Hardly ikely, is it?

Anonymous said...

Like Zngr said a party like the BNP getting support means things are getting out of control. But are the views of the BNP that far right? Their views on homosexuality would have been fairly mainstream a generation ago. Now its virtually a crime to be "homophobic".

Racism is not all from whites against minorities. There are increasing numbers of attacks by minorities on whites. As the number of minorities rises the attacks on whites will increase. Minorities also attack each other. The established white minority will eventually become a minority in its own country.

Mass immigration is not a good idea at all and only introduces ethnic conflict where there was none. The most sensible thing is to remain a monocultural and monoethnic society like Japan or at least keep the white indigenous culture and ethnicity dominant.

Anti-mass-immigration is the most sensible postion and is not the same as being anti-immigrant.

Zngr said...

In Finland, the minorities are far more racist towards each other and Finns instead of the other way around. West-Africans and Somalis fight, as do Turks and the Kurds who despise each other. The Iraqis and Kurds also fight the Somalis, as do the minority Roma Gypsy. Finns hardly fight anyone, there has not been a single verified case during the 21st century of a gang of native Finns seriously harming or killing immigrants because of purely racist motives, i.e. colour of their skin or country of origin.

A very light reading of human history instantly reveals "racism" or "xenophobia" is not a white or western trait but a global phenomenon spanning all cultures and ethnic groups since the dawn of time. It's funny how the liberal left tries to make believe it is not so, or how some Muslims seem to honestly believe they are somehow victimized by the West every time something they don't like happens. And our intelligentsia handily agrees with them. Baffling!

But ethnic minorities are also "victim" groups so it's politically incorrect to say they are as racist, or more so, then secular Westerners (in 2007, Minority Rights organization, a non-Western only group IIRC, determined the most racist country on earth is in fact Somalia). The media is, for reasons I am unable to quite understand, desperately trying to find new "hate crimes" in which Finns have chosen immigrants as their targets but they always end up being something else (i.e. immigrants fighting each other) or then completely fabricated. So they have turned to blogs and the internet for lack of substantial hate crime and point out critical blogs and message forum posts as "proof" of the inherent hate and racism of Finns instead.

Anyway, I'm very pro-immigrant, because I have many good immigrant friends and most of all co-workers who I appreciate and value highly, but also very anti-mass-immigration. These two do not by any means count each other out.

The left always intentionally confuses anti-mass-immigration to mean opposition of all immigrants as groups as individuals.

Of course, most people simply oppose mass immigration which is HARMFUL to a society, and from ethnic groups that have poor support ratio (i.e. for whom the tax-payer must provide housing and benefits because they are for some reason or other unemployable, be it lack of education, cultural differences, discrimination, lack of jobs to match skills, lack of motivation - it does not matter in the end if they still end up being wholly dependent on handouts or crime).

The left-wing strategy has always been to confuse opposition of the endless stream of asylum shoppers and their never ending family re-unification schemes with normal, healthy work related immigration, which actually very few people would vehemently oppose.

In this way the left-wing socialists and liberals can say all criticism towards immigration is racist and illogical, even harmful, even though they must instinctively know it's not true.

Because if they actually answered the REAL questions and concerns and criticism of the anti-immigration block, they would have to admit the concern is real and valid and the arguments impossible to refute in any other than an ideological level.