Monday, 1 December 2008

Gypsies tramps and thieves

Do I imagine it, or has there been a significant increase in the gypsy population since I've been away? If so, what a disaster.

These particular cultural enrichers are taught that their ancestry involved stealing in the name of God, and as such God has thus rewarded them with the license to steal from non-Gypsies as a means to live. A bit like the Religion Of Peace in that sense. God was certainly successful in this, as they have, in the intervening time, managed to scam incredible sums of money from their victims.

Another feature of gypsy ‘culture’ is that women are the main breadwinners (bread stealers?). In a polar reverse of almost every other culture, whereby a man’s pride is his ability to provide, a male gypsy is demeaned by ‘ordinary’ work. Hence women and children are trained in thievery and scamming from the earliest age.

Their abilities are truly extraordinary. For instance ex-Olympic sprinter Ben Johnson was relieved of his wallet by a small group of gypsy girls who accosted him on the famous Via Veneto in Rome. He gave chase but they outran him!
Despite the usual bleatings of discrimination, gypsy ‘culture’ deems it important that they keep separate from mainstream society, which, and I kid you not, they regard as corrupting! This is like the Muslim with four simultaneous wives, who trades in the oldest for a new teenage model every few years, and who regards Western sexual mores as offensive. Which they do, I might add.
Gypsies and Romanians are not synonymous

There’s a popular misconception that gypsies and Romanians are one and the same. This isn't true at all and causes ordinary Romanians no end of grief and indignation. The belief probably stems from the gypsies being known as Romani, but this actually refers to their language. In fact they originated in India, or more correctly in what is today’s Pakistan, in the Sind region.
For some reason they left there and exploded into central Europe around the 15th century.
Even then they were up to their tricks. The usual scam involved a group claiming to be from Egypt showing up in a city and informing city officials that they were Christians doomed to wander for a period of years to fulfil a penance imposed upon them. They’d collect food, money and letters of protection from the city and then continue to the next town.

I've had – mercifully - only two significant exposures to gypsies. On one occasion in Barcelona I was sitting at a pavement cafĂ© with some colleagues, our laptops at our feet. Nobody was within 20 feet of us. Suddenly we noticed a row breaking out amongst some gypsies further down the road, much shouting, pushing and screaming, which went on for a few minutes.

Shortly after one of us noticed that his laptop was gone. We were totally dumbfounded as nobody had been near us for about 15 minutes, and we knew it had been there in the intervening time. In a state of great agitation we called the waiter. He shook his head in sympathy and explained what had happened. The ‘row’ had been a distraction. While we’d been looking at it a gypsy accomplice had used a fishing rod to hook the laptop, drag it towards him (more likely her) and make off with it!

The second one was a beauty. Friends of mine in Cork objected to a landlord adding a major extension to the house adjoining theirs. In a highly original move he then filled up the house with about a dozen gypsy ‘refugees’. They made everyone’s life a nightmare. They stole everything that could be stolen, including clothes off their line. Worse, they fought and screamed all day and night, and their girls and younger women entertained their johns in the adjoining areas, often in view of neighbouring children.

These incidents are typical. Throughout Europe gypsies have become a byword for thieving, scamming, welfare dependence, truancy, violence and debased cultural norms. We owe these people nothing. We should force them out without compassion, or at a minimum subject them to the full force of the law. As long as they choose, and I emphasise choose, to live as nomadic parasites they should be treated as such.

If you’re interested in learning more I recommend License To Steal, Traveling Con Artists, Their Games, Their Rules---Your Money (Dennis Marlock & John Dowling)


Anonymous said...

Yes, would tend to agree with you Savant-not the most noble of tribes, are they now? Why are they here? What good are they doing? An awful shower, should be sent home straight away. Good musicians though!

Anonymous said...

anonymous - they can come here legitimately as we allowed free access to the most recent EU members. There is a restriction in that you're supposed to have a job 'or a business'. The latter's the catch of course. You can set up 'Begging and Prostitution Enterprises Ltd.' and you're away!

Anonymous said...

These people have been like this for centuries, they're not going to change. So anyone trying to assimilate them is bound to fail.

McCann Man

Anonymous said...

compassion compunction

Anonymous said...

I think they're the worst immigrants of all, even putting Nigerians and Somalis to it. Reckon you dont agree, Savant?

Steve K.

SAVANT said...

I probably do agree Steve. At least you'll get some worthwhile people with the others, but the gypsies are beyond redemption.

Unknown said...

Well to get kicked out of India for wheeling and dealing they must have been some badassed mothers!

SAVANT said...

Good one rat!!

ZZ said...

I'll swop them with our lot any day...they can only be an improvement...!

Anonymous said...

I dont agree with albeus. 'His lot' appear - and are - so bad becuase they're in a large majority. Gypsies, thankfully, are in a small minority. I'd say individually they're a lot worse than the SA blacks.


Bantu Education said...

Not ever being exposed to their parasitic reality in my sheltered Sussex upbringing, in my heart I always wanted to believe in the romantic image of Gypsies as portrayed in "From Russia with Love" amongst others.

I think we owe Adolf an apology. As I grow older and (hopefully) wiser I find myself also slowly but reluctantly revising my opinion about the other mob he didn't much like.

ZZ said...

Your lot (African refugees) is currently a small minority - see what chaos they already cause in Europe....
You'll still wish for the good ol' days when you bitched about the!

Anonymous said...

I remember a Romanian guy I knew in Dublin told me how much he hated the Romany gypsies - he said the government there tried to give them jobs, and they only reason they moved abroad was because they didn't want 'normal' (i.e. non-criminal) jobs.
This would make them the only immigrant group in Ireland fleeing too much employment in their own country!

Roma Justice said...

It saddens me to see voice given to bigots like this blogger, and also to the book he is peddling, written by Dennis Marlock.

Incidentally, I was led to this obscene blog link by one of Mr. Marlock's book links.

About the Author:

Dennis Marlock is the owner of a website Http:// that degrades and defames one specific ethnic group (Rom) over all others, under the color of authority and the guise of crime and fraud prevention.

It is unlawful to discriminate based on ethnicity. The Romani people are such an ethnic group. They are a Micro-minority among other ethnic groups.

"Gypsies" are second only to Jews, as a coveted symbol of extremist hate, within the White Supremacist / Neo - Nazi hate ideology.

The word Gypsy is considered derogatory, especially in the defamatory context that Mr. Marlock utilizes it in.

Mr. Marlock specifically, repeatedly targets the Romany people for degradation and defamation in all his writings and crime / fraud prevention speeches.

On his fraud prevention website alone, he mentions GYPSIES in regard to being responsible for crime over 95 times. Roma 16 times, yet all other ethnic, racial and organized crime groups, including the MAFIA, less than 5 times each.

The fact is; US crime statistics show that the Romany people are responsible for over all crime in such a minuscule percentages that they can't be assigned a classification or numerical value.

Everything Mr. Marlock touches and creates is filled with neo-Nazi ideology and sentiment.

Most of his Internet book listings lead back to various other Romani themed Hate sites, like this one.

If I were to apply Mr. Marlock's formula for stereotyping, then I could point out that he hails from and originates in Wisconsin. Wisconsin is the second most active state in the country for neo-Nazi (NSM) activity and membership.

I could therefore suspect that Dennis Marlock is a stealth white supremacist who utilizes and exploits the criminal justice system to further his own neo - Nazi agenda.

I find it particularly disturbing that Mr. Marlock has been in a position of power as a police officer. I shudder to think of what racist discrimination he may have been a party to, under the color of authority, during his employment with the Milwaukee police department.

Mr. Marlock is obviously a racist hater who targets and attacks one ethnic group - the Romany people.
He has written several defamatory books specifically about the Romany people. Again under the guise of crime prevention, and under the color of authority.

The Romani people (Gypsies) are an easy mark for Mr. Marlock because they virtually have no legal clout or political voice here in the USA.

One of the most significant voices that speaks out on behalf of Romany people; Ian F. Hancock Professor, Ph.D. is openly libeled, slandered and defamed on several pages scattered throughout the Internet - written, administrated and hosted by Dennis Marlock!

This type of outrageous inciting and targeting (under the color of authority) is what leads to ethnic cleansing, pogroms, holocausts and genocide.

As in the Nazi regime, once the Gypsy is socially acceptable for ethnic cleansing - genocide is next.

Mr. Marlock boasts that he is endorsed by the City of Milwaukee, The Milwaukee PD and that he is a frequent guest on talk shows!

It is hard enough to come to a new country and try to blend in and make it without this sort of hatred hobbling all honest attempts to adapt to a host social environment.

It has taken most Romani families close to 3 generations to recover from the holocaust, as well as adapt to a changing world.

Most Romani who come to America come with the same hope for change that brought the Irish, Germans and Italians before them.

Just like the earlier immigrant groups, they come here because for the Romani people it is near to impossible to get past the stigma, blatant defamation and unhindred discrimination they are subjected to in Europe.

Case in point ... this hate and venom spewing blogger. This is the very ethnic cleansing inciting crap some Europeans feel at liberty to spew forth about the Romani people. And nobody seems to object or do anything about it.

Then they come to America and who is waiting to trip them up here ... this bloggers distant cousin 30 times removed ... Dennis Marlock.

But they still make it, despite the racist efforts of people like this.

Like most other immigrants coming to America most Romani people lack education and language skills and thus are forced to work as servants within American society.

Like most other immigrants Romani immigrants adapt and raise their families by means of hard, back breaking and HONEST work.

They do this to give their children a chance at a better life.

Like all other ethnic groups that have immigrated to the US, Romani children grow up and abandon the old ways. They are usually the first in 3 or more generations to finish college.

Romani people succeed in the US because they do not have the obstacle of blatant discrimination to over come, as they would in places like Europe.

The next step in the evolution is for future generations of Romani to be able to hold their heads up without being shamed by their host society at large.

And this, will never be as long as haters like Dennis Marlock have their way.

The Blogger of this hate page is a mere nuisance compared to Dennis Marlock.

Dennis Marlock is a dangerous man because he uses the power of his police uniform and badge to further his agenda of hatred.

Please, do not lend credence or support to Bloggers like this or to Authors like Dennis Marlock.

I know this response will never see the light of day. Just as on Mr. Marlock's website ... this blogger is probably too cowardly to offer a forum for discussion to his racist spews. But at least I have had my say.

Anonymous said...

zinnamongirl , you seem very well documented.

But I'll bet you'll change your opinion after you live among them

Anonymous said...

In watching the dilemma unfold in the UK over the past few months I gather that the British don't so much hate the Romani people, more that they do not like some of the habits that they bring with them.

Our system here in the US does not ENABLE that outmoded Romani life style. When Roma come here, they must adapt. The US government does not build them camping sites nor do they allow segregation.

We have tough laws for everything from littering, panhandling, loitering, unlicensed commerce, camping, truancy, curfews, child abuse, domestic violence, tenant over crowding, exploitation, vagrancy to peeing in the street. We go after and prosecute everyone equally without exception.

When immigrants come here they learn the hard way that they must leave their bad habits behind them. There is no room or tolerance for bad old world habits here.

Moral turpitude is a reason for exclusion from the citizenship and green-card process. Commit a serious crime and you are out of here.

On the same token, when immigrants do want to fit in and adapt, there are no obstacles placed in their way.

The harassment, discrimination in employment and housing, the name calling and blatant persecution is not tolerated.

Every effort is made to help immigrants to adapt. Nobody expects them to be perfect straight off the boat. They are given time and protection while they adapt.

As long as they are here legally and abide by the laws of the land.

And yes, it's a hard life for them. But that is the immigrant price all of our immigrant forbears have had to pay. This is a nation of immigrants after all.

The peer pressure to adapt and integrate for immigrants is tremendous here. No immigrant group is immune, or can escape being absorbed.

Within one or two generations all immigrants have completely been absorbed to the point that they cannot be distinguished from the other citizens.

It's every Immigrant lament, that their kids don't want to learn and speak the old language, or follow the old culture and customs. The kids, even the ones who come here under the age of 12 - just want to fit in with the other kids, and with society at large.

I think perhaps European countries should not allow people from other countries to come, unless they are also going to be allowed to work.

I'm not going to say that Roma who are stuck in a time warp are absolutely right about everything all the time. There is MUCH that needs to be addressed and changed, for their own sake.

Stop enabling the old Roma ways. Those times are no more, and ought to be no more. Roma need to embrace modern society, social order and progress like anyone else.

This is done through education. The only way that will happen is if your citizenry stops harassing and debasing their children when they come to school. If the kids are not going to be abused, then the Roma families will not be fearful of sending their children to your schools.

Roma come to your country for a better life, a modern life away from their outmoded ways. They should at least be given a decent chance.

At the very least, embrace their children, do not abuse them psychologically with constant debasement, bullying and harassment.

How can a Romani child grow up to be a contributing citizen when their self worth and self esteem is damaged from early on, through your constant debasing, marginalization and oppression?

All that does is make matters worse and feeds a vicious cycle.

Quent said...

I'm from the U.S. and I did not recognize the country the previous poster was describing. I would very much like to move to the part of it he or she is describing.

Please, 'anonymous' tell me where you live! Just the general location would be fine.

Anonymous said...

I agree with quent. Could you tell us what part of the country yu refer to?

Anonymous said...

Some irish travellers have been here in Germany recently. They sold fake chainsaws (price 150 EUR, real market value 30 EUR) and were soon gone to find some more suckers.

Anonymous said...

Ziehende Geuner (Zigeuner) literally means roaming con-artists. Blue collar to white collar, we all have a little larceny in our hearts. A cheat is Shyster; no matter if they work in the White house or the Outhouse.

Sorry, all you racist "Gypsy" haters but people from all races, cultures and economic backgrounds engage in all sorts of nefarious deeds,from the Carpenter who cheats on the quality of materials versus the quality paid for, the auto mechanic who over charges unsuspecting people for "Brakes" and auto repairs they don't need, when they can hardly afford to replace the leaking oil filter that is really the problem, to the dentist who charges $5,000 to save one single tooth, but will pull it for $250,00, and let you die of an infection IF you can't afford that. Do you know right now Billions of people are suffering from toothaches and dental abscesses (that can spread from person to person, and cause permanent damage to a persons heart, and other detrimental effects on public health) that they cannot afford to treat?

Want to complain, then complain about the biggest bunch of Scheisters of all Politicians and anyone involved in the medical or insurance industry.

How about us on a personal level. How Scheisterish and selfish are we? Billions are going blind because they don't get enough Vitamin A in their annual diet. One single Vitamin A supplement capsule per month could save an other human beings vision. Did you know that Billions of people right now get less nourishment and essential vitamins a week than a typical Westerner gets in half a slice of white bread?

How about the Bar Keep who replaces fine Brandy with cheap swill, your Employer who expects you to show up for work early, stay after hours, and whittles away at your private time by cultivating an UNPAID work ethic, that presses you into working through your breaks, lunch breaks, and even into taking work home with you. Try adding up that time per week, times ( X ) your Hourly wage, times (X) a year, and see what you will get!

Get real people, first of all there are no "Gypsies". In a business sense a "Gypsy" is anyone, regardless of race, who performs work without proper licensing. Beware of the "Gypsy" roofers, gardeners, carpenters, and other contractors! It's a guild thing.

In the USA, where I live everything is either illegal or requires a license, probably even farting.

Look folks, "Gypsies" are Indian/s. You think "Gypsies" are a minority, but actually there are Billions of them, with their own country. India is so massive, populated and powerful, they have nuclear capacity and nuclear weapons! India has offered to take "Gypsies" back (after 1000 years of forced absence) upon the condition that they convert, to whatever religion India practices.

Anyone with two drops of Indian blood in them, has a little "Gypsy" in them. And don't forget that England occupied India for a long time. So don't be so quick to point that racist finger at the "Gypsy" unless you know the full genealogical DNA history of your own family tree.

So, all you racist Scheister haters, who dare to throw the first unjustified stone at "Gypsies" please realize that you don't really hate "Gypsies". What you hate are Scheisters, especially those who are not of your same race and skin color.

If you just hate "Gypsies" then go to their people, go to India, and plead your hate.

Better yet, follow the golden rule of Karma of "what goes around - comes around".

zeitgeist said...

anon 18.00. Most of what you say is true, but you use common arguments "whataboutery" to show others can have similar traits to gypsies. This is true of course.

The distinction tho is that ALMOST ALL gypsies are dishonest shysters and con-artists. That's the key point. They are incompatible with 'normal' society.

Anonymous said...

Zeitgeist - Have ever felt hunger? I don't mean, like on a diet, or when you have a hankering for high tea at Harrods, a spot of tea with a cucumber sandwich, or a nice cut of prime rib, when you can only afford a hamburger. I mean real starvation!

When you were a child, were you so malnourished and famished that you had to roam neighborhoods, and wait till someone threw their dinner left overs out into the dirt, for their dogs? Did you then have to sneak in, and steal that thrown out food away from that poor dog, then have to run like hell on wobbly malnourished legs, so the dog won't get you, before the people came out of their houses? And IF you made it away with a few scraps of edibles, did you sit hidden in a bush somewhere, scraping the dirt and gravel off whatever surviving morsel, and then wolf it down, grateful to have it?

I was that child, and I was five years old at the time. My little sister was so malnourished as a child, she had rickets. So, malnourished in fact, that whenever she did eat she was plagued by vomiting and diarrhea, because her digestive tract could not handle the food.

And no, we did not live in a poverty stricken third world country. We were displaced persons, refugees, and holocaust survivors, who were forced to squat on toxic waste dumps, and in abandoned or dismantled Nazi forced labor villages, because "society" refused to rent to us, refused to give my begging for work mother, employment. My mother who could barely read and write because while other young girls were going to school, she was laboring in sweat shops her entire formative years in Nazi concentration labor camps, without receiving even the most basic in primary education. We were forced to live on the fringes of our host country society.

And we were not "Gypsies" we were Jewish Holocaust survivors and also ethnic displaced Germans, driven from our adopted homelands, and forced to return to our ethnic origins - Germany.

I still cry when I think of the time I had to steal food from dogs, and feel very badly that those poor dogs had to go hungry on account of me. But that is ALL I have ever stolen. I still feel bad about it, despite the fact that I was starving. At the time however, I had no thought that that poor animal would have to go hungry, if I stole its food. I was five years old, and driven purely by hunger.

I'm not pontificating here, just pointing out what might drive some to desperate measures and survival associated petty theft.

Zeitgeist - I appreciate what you say. To me a Shyster by any other name causes equal harm. I abhor violence, violent offenders, corruption on any level, selfish people, and anyone who is driven by pure greed. But even for me, all bets are off, while under the pressure of SURVIVAL driven desperation.

Just look how people act during major disasters - when aid is slow to arrive. The "Have nots" loot and take what they need to survive, and the "Haves" arm themselves to protect their stuff.

When in reality, all the people should just work together and have helped each other out, in the first place.

Everyone in the world has a place in it and value, and every person has the right to be treated with dignity, and respect.

Zeitgeist said...

anon 17.26. This is a very moving story and I feel deeply for you. I do know that ethnic Germans were treated terribly after WW2, especially those from Russia.

However, there is a distinction. Germans, and espcially German Jews, have been high achievers always. When faced with impossible situations they have worked their way out of them. You seem to be a case in point.

However, while society might not, make that does not, encourage gypsies, is it any wonder? In most western European countries gypsies can and do claim all kinds of welfare. Ok. But they also steal, beg and get engaged in all other kinds of criminal behaviour.

Your tolerance and compassion are commendable, but we'll have to judge gypsies by their actions for the foreseeable future.

Tony in Va. said...

France is leading example of what countries need to do.
Restore political backbone, act and secure the safety of native citizens. This global transient chaos needs to be stopped by elected who are supposed to keep laws and protect citizens.
Weakness has no place in leadership of national enforcement of laws. The Constitution guarantees equal protection under the laws - - - not distorted judgements issued by selected judges.

Ace said...

Some gypsies rented a house near me in n. Virginia. They ripped the doors off of the cabinets to burn in the fireplace. Classy people. A couple of young guys tried to pick my pocket in the subway in Madrid. My fellow passengers had no illusions about those pricks.

A British immigration or customs official went to visit her parents and came back to find gypsies were living in her house. One was wearing one of her dresses and offered her some of her own wine.

I've seen a picture of a gypsy defecating on the sidewalk in broad daylight in front of God and man.

And we all know about their moving into farmers' fields.

These comments about how they're held down are laughable. I can't understand how naive people just have to cry tolerance when it's clear that tolerance isn't warranted.

Anonymous said...

Their IQ has been measured, and ranges from 60 to 70 depending on the country.

They have an exceptional rate of mental illnesses, due to inbreeding (it's not the only ethnic group to manifest this, is it?).

Back to their IQ.
It assures these people would still have no way to assimilate into European culture if they ever wished it. That they specialize in robbery is a natural consequence.
We all do what we can do, and certainly nothing more than what we can do.

See what the Japanese did in electronics in a few decades. It's not like Colombia or Qatar could have done the same; neither, to be outspoken, could France or Ireland.
However, the Japanese (and the Chinese) resort to idea robbery and copying where they have their weak point that is, having new ideas and invention.